Liberation and freedom: self-realization, moksha, nirvana

The way which can be told is not the way. The doubt. The doubt. So I just a thing thought came to my mind. Maybe there is an influence. A person who is not educated at all and is not aware that there are schools and teachers who actually educate people. If you will ask a very educated person, what is education? Will he be able to answer and what is education? He will have to go through the whole process. >> To exactly know what is education. That is the powerful enough to fulfill any desire which will come into your mind. But you are so bored with them that you choose not to do anything. That state of mind can be called motion.

You getting rid of desire is nothing. Capacity to fulfill any desire. And you choose not to. Then you will experience motion. If you have a lot of desire but cannot fulfill them fulfill them and you say Nothing you will remain frustrated all your life. And but you will try to pose that oh you Yeah, it's nothing for me. Yeah, I see. You don't care.

LIBERATION FROM WHAT?

The immerged after liberation of it, if you are liberated from something . It’s like beyond, I mean…

Guruji: After you are liberated from something

than only you can look back and understand what you are liberated from?

what sublime state is establish than? After liberation …

Guruji: Go back to Yoga Sutras also: After achieving everything, then even the satisfaction you go beyond of achieving something . That is the technical point.

WHAT IS PURE CONSCIOUSNESS?

Your mind is working with electromagnetic currents, charges, so when your subconscious is wake up , charge will became tremendous and yore all body will transform into electrical body. That will be pure consciousness.

And no past will remain, no future will remain you will be establish in the moment of the present, forever. And, moment of present was there in the past also and it will remain in the future also . So when you’re establish in the moment of the present - you are everywhere. Wherever you will focus - you will experience that . It is such a simple thing

STHIRA-SUKHAM ASANAM

Earth herself is not steady, She is moving

at a very breakneck speed and moving around a Sun at the same time. Sthira-Sukham Asanam is simply means to make your body steady enough, so the spirit inside will feel relaxed. That is steadiness.

Guruji: that is self-realization.

Manifesting the Immortal Substance

"Guruji, are mana (mind), buddhi (intellect), viveka (discrimination) the same or different?"

Guruji: "In totality it's the Mind. Just like hands, legs, head, etc are different organs of the same man, similarly buddhi, viveka, etc are different parts of the mind. Mind is basically one."

"Then why do we have conflict in the mind?"

Guruji: "It's actually a mechanism induced by Nature inside us to gain knowledge. How will you draw a conclusion if you don't think from different directions? Without friction there's no energy, and every conflict is created by nature to generate energy. Without conflicts we'd all be leading a vegetable life."

"Does that mean conflicts are induced from outside?"

Guruji: "It just means that the mind is processing what you are experiencing. Those who don’t understand that get worried about the conflicting thoughts in their mind. See, as soon as you see or hear anything, you are mentally involved. The mind will store and process the information, and until it reaches some conclusion there will be conflicts appearing in the mind.

"Quiet mind doesn't mean an inert position. Einstein said when an object travels at the speed of light, it is in the perfect rest condition. Those who appear quiet, may be the speed of their mind is way too high. This means that their mind is working or vibrating at a rate which is beyond our imagination, so we think it is inert, but it is too fast for us. When we say that someone has become inert in sam?dhi, it may mean that they have gone in the perfect rest condition, and their consciousness has gone beyond the light-speed and is vibrating in a very high realm. This is exactly what happens.

"It is like the story of the caterpillar and the butterfly. Caterpillar is not trained to see the butterfly who will fly away leaving the cocoon behind when the time comes, while the caterpillar mourns for the cocoon. Life is a deep thing."

"Sometimes there are conflicts between different actions as well, which has different results. For example, should I eat tasty food or do some exercise."

Guruji: "Instead of hankering after the memory of food, it's better to eat it and be done with it. You should also remember that taste doesn't fill your stomach. So fill taste, but not stomach. Stomach will fill only with bread, not with chocolate. This is a proof of the advancement of human civilization that we invented chocolate: No bird has been able to make omelette even though eggs come them them only. Similarly no cow can make yogurt or ghee even though it produces the milk."

"It makes sense. But sometimes I wonder if such processing actually means we are going from natural to unnatural."

Guruji: "In a way it is not, as I've already said that to make ghee is like going from mortality to immortality."

"How?"

Guruji: "Here's how: People say that the soul is omnipresent, and everybody has a soul which is immortal. But even though we have an immortal substance inside us, we still die. What is immortality then? Somebody asked me that so I gave them this answer:

"Cow gives milk. Milk has ghee in it, but in the raw milk it is not visible. And despite the presence of that immortal substance, the milk goes bad or sour. The process to extract ghee from milk is like a yogic discipline: first you heat milk then cool it off, then turn it into yoghurt, then churn the yogurt, then take the butter out, then heat the butter, and then the substance which comes out, ghee, is immortal. Pure ghee doesn't go bad even in hundreds of years. Similarly, soul is in everybody which is immortal. But those who don’t go through this process, through yogic austerities, they'll never realize its immortality nor will they ever experience their soul."

"Wow!"

Guruji: "Mind blowing, isn't it? The soul is omnipresent, but to reveal it or to manifest it we have to do tapasy?. Just like ghee comes out of milk after so many transformations, similarly, with yoga s?dhan? after so many transformations a man reaches his immortal substance, which was always inside him. But to bring it forth, he has to go through through these transforming processes.

"Anybody could wag their tongue that the soul is omnipresent. Yes, we know it's omnipresent; who doesn't know that? (laughs) But how to catch it, how to realize it, how to make it appear? That will not be possible without tapasy?. Everybody has a body and a soul; every cow gives milk. But here a realized master, a man of knowledge, a guru is needed, who knows how to extract ghee out of the milk, who can tell you everything about the body and it's potential and how to transform it. Those who mislead people into philosophy shouldn't be considered as gurus."

"This also proves why tapasy? is necessary for everyone."

Guruji: "Tapasy? is only necessary for those who want to do it, who have understood. For someone who is beginning to understand his divinity, who is beginning to realize, 'how I look is not really everything I am. I could develop to a much more sublime height, I could even be immortal. All the necessary ingredients are within me. I should learn all the processes for this development, and I am ready for all the physical and mental transformations as a result of these processes.'

"It takes time to understand these things - took me years. In the beginning, everybody repeats the common words: self realization or god realization. That's all! But 'self realization' describes this exactly. God realization is a vague thing, but self realization is closer to the reality."

can we say that beyond the carbon is beyond the karma?

Guruji: yes, Alakh Niranjan.

what is happen with karma of the yogi reaching Samadhi?

Guruji: he is able to create his own future, he is able to create his own place in the creation, he is free.

To realize soul is the very big thing. Then to make it your Guru is absolutely another thing. Everybody talks about god – but god has not created souls. No religion describe, who created the souls – nowhere it is mentioned. From where it come, where it goes, what is that nature, why they come into that body? Nothing. But they go in details that god created this and that. That makes yoga very important, because only yoga teach us how to realize your soul. We’re not go into god realization, we’re for soul realization.

What is the man? The future ghost is the man. This is future for everybody. Of course it is interesting. But I think most of the religious people try to avoid these things. I don’t know why. Otherwise life is bleak – there is no hope.

WHAT IS SELF-REALIZATION?

is it possible to see the realization of the person in the chart?

Guruji: probability will be there: you cannot say 100% that he will be realized.

but the possibilities You will see?

Guruji: only the spiritual possibilities -about moksha and something like that. Self-realization is absolutely different phenomena.

could we have a little understanding seeing the mahadasha of the person?

Guruji: they say: he will become very religious, he will become highly spiritual; but there is no planetary situation which will tell us that he will become the self-realised person. It is assumed, that if he’s becoming highly spiritual then there is a chance of realization as well. But now I think: realization is too bigger thing.

Seeing god is nothing compare to self-realization.

We have already discussed, what is realization: in this world of illusion, you make your presence real: that is realization. That means you’re no longer a part of imagination of someone else.

if we make ourselves real: our mind will be more powerful than the creator’s?

Guruji: no, we cannot compare; but your existence will become real. You will come out of his imagination. That’s a main point.

This is what is written in Shiva Sutras: that the siddha has the absolutely independent nature: because he is no longer part of someone’s imagination. He maybe creator of anything. It’s too bigger thing – self- realization! But whatever: we love to talk about it and it remains in discussions – spiritual and religious discussions; maybe some day someone…even this is not a less thing – that people keep on discussing on it.

many perceives the self-realization like a training of personal development?

Guruji: but realization has millions of the steps! One time one sadhu was discussing self-realization, and I asked him: suppose you’re on the road and a woman comes and slaps you; how you will categorise it? He was silent and I said: this is again part of your self-realization! You will know exactly how you will feel if woman will slap you on the road! It is part of your self-realization. Self-realization goes a very long way. Small waves in life, small things in life: you keep realizing yourself, you keep realizing your different angles of your own nature. It’s a very-very wide thing.

could the nature be changed with the time?

Guruji: how much we know about nature? You will be more in tune with your own nature with time.

even facing the opposite things?

Guruji: of course. In fact, when you’re facing some strong opposition: in that moment you’re strongly aware of your own self. It will make you even more aware.

for creator it’s not good – if somebody will wake up and realised himself?

Guruji: he has never intervened – except in our religious books. He beyond carrying I think.

what are his functions after creating the creation?

Guruji: what we do when we create a game and we start to play? We enjoy it! Enjoying all the way.

many people think that samadhi is just the high concentration?

Guruji: ok, good for them! It’s all luck. Hard work is there, but luck plays a major role.

back to the topic of being real: our reality is only our own imagination?

Guruji: your own consciousness and your own mind! Imagination is just an expression.

This is another thing which you become conscious: how you’re reacting. It is just another degree of consciousness.

PERSEPTION OF TRUTH

the seeker attains liberation if he begins from salokya?

Guruji: salokya means when he entered the abode of some particular god and begins to live there. So all this tapas and all this hard work is for eternal retirement – no problem, nothing, take it easy finally( laughing).

when devotee of Shiva ends 108 crores of japa – he can practice shuddha yoga – what is it?

Guruji: that means after so many japas he qualified enough to practice yoga. Shuddha yoga means the purest form of yoga.

I think it’s a good system because all we have so much religious carryovers; even if truth is been said we’re trying to analyze it from the religious backdrop. Pure mind is very rare thing.

why they are saying that if woman is true devotee of Shiva – she must concentrate on the symbol of Shakti, not Shiva?

Guruji: Shakti is half of Shiva. They go together.

MOKSHA

If you are powerful enough to fulfil any desire that comes into your mind — but you are so bored with them that you choose not to do anything — that state of mind can be called “moksha.” Getting rid of desire is nothing; having the capacity to fulfil any desire — and choosing not to — then you will experience moksha. It’s not for the weak!

if you have a lot of desires — but you cannot fulfil them?

Guruji: nothing; you will remain frustrated all your life. But you will try to pose as if you don’t care. But you are fair enough to say: “I don’t care.”

when people are talking about Kundalini what they usually mean?

Guruji: illumination happen, realization happen… I’m happy to remain endarkened. I don’t want illumination.

what they mean when they talk about enlightening?

Guruji: I have absolutely no idea.

in Gorakhbodh it’s very frequent topic about that abhaya and Nirbhaya state: what is this state without any fear?

Guruji: to become nirbhay is the greatest of the great achievement. The main liberation is from your fear. Only then you can relax.

it is again removing some kleshas or obstacles from the consciousness?

Guruji: every klesha is a different expression of fear. I will quote here James Hadley Chase – all time thriller writer: fear is the key which opens every safe, pocket and wallet. He was a great writer.

so main structure of this world is fear?

Guruji: of course!

where is love?

Guruji: fear of punishment makes you hold on certain disciplines.

but mostly philosophers says about love – everybody is in love, love is everywhere…

Guruji: when a policeman confronts them – suddenly philosophy disappears.

This is the main result of what you called liberation or attaining nirvana: that is nirbhay state.

so vairagya is coming before that state?

Guruji: it starts yoga sadhana

People are talking that magic is superstitious thing, one should not believe in magic – it’s all technic; but I think: every life – it is magic! Whatever we have seen – is magic. And we’re trying to understand the mechanism behind it. What about life? It is the greatest magic I see. Enjoy magic!

it’s like to look at magician: when you don’t know the trick – it is interesting, but if you know the secret …

Guruji: no interest absolutely. When we don’t know something – it’s very difficult. Like we are walking: when we are able to walk – it’s nothing. But when you have the physical problem – the simple walk becomes too much complicated program, the simply walk. How many muscles are involved, how maintain the balance, how the gravitation works, the Earth are moving under you – I mean so much physics is involved in such simple process. But for us it’s not a problem – we just walking.

What is freedom? When everything is for free – that is freedom. We are not free yet, but we have yoga to become free. And we will get everything for free then. You will have freedom from the limitations – you will have superbody and super consciousness.

SAMADHI KUNDALINI TECHNICAL ASPECTS

we discussed the wonderful level of the development of the yogi when he even doesn’t need the own spirit inside and he is connected with the Ishwar Himself: he could be considered as Akula?

Guruji: he is with the Ishwar: he is kuleen – but with the higher family. He will become omnipresent: wherever Ishwar will be – that yogi’s presence will be there. That too bigger thing. He will become like internet( smiling)- everywhere.

could we say that Matsyendranath and Gorakhnathachieved this level?

Guruji: definitely, I’m sure. If they cannot achieve that – then who can achieve?

It goes without saying.

ILLUSION OF FREEDOM

It was during a heavy winter: there was a thunderstorm and heavy rain outside. My monkey was here, very cozy, heater was on; I was giving her some dry fruits and chocolate… then it came to me: she’s in confinement – but she’s so cozy and happy. And what about free and liberated monkeys, who are enjoying the freedom? Running here and there to survive, hungry, hoping from somewhere the food will come. That means: not every confinement is bad or like slavery. It is a very welcoming thing if someone is taking care of you. Liberation may not always be a very good option. We need to think on that.

Very often if someone takes care of you – they want something back from you, no?

Guruji: No, it’s about very careful confinement – not any confinement. But in any confinement – even if you go to prison – at least of cold you will be free. You don’t have to pay for electricity – it’s government work.

This body is given to feel the particular sentence of time. It’s like a prison.

Q : I’ve read somewhere that because of affection of different planets and cosmic cycles by taking many-many births the person can become enlighten even without practicing yoga?

Guruji : I think and it is my personal opinion that yoga might be the only way to make your mind very powerful and develop your consciousness to the unlimited limits. I don’t see any other way.

Q : so by incarnating many-many times we cannot become enlighten?

Guruji : no. there are 2-3 types of people who are going to the prison; as a direct result of their karma they perform some crime and they’re thrown to the prison. And there are the policemen also, the officers of the prison – they are not prisoners, but they are visiting the prison and take care of it. Then there are some other social workers – out of compassion they visit the prison; also reporters, media people – they are going there on their free will, not as at affect of their karmas. I think this prison example is good enough to understand why we’re here. Think on that.

The power in the physical world and in the spiritual world is measured only by power of your mind. If you have enough power of mind to influence others in society – you will make more money then others. Even making money and so-called success in life in the physical world depends on the power of your mind. In astral world there is no money so only the power of the mind is expressed there in its purest form. That is the only criteria.

Q : so who we are – prisoners or travelers?

Guruji: spirits are endless and beginningless. They live till eternity. Their time feeling maybe different then ours; just to feel the time they entered inside the body to feel the particular period of time – like 50 years, 60 years, 10 years – that’s why we call body the sentence of time. Even in Hatha Yoga Pradipika they are saying it’s Kala danda – it’s the punishment of time or the sentence of time. Only in a human body you’re in the situation of study Time itself.

Q : what is the significance of the previous birth?

Guruji : the earth-bounded spirit or let’s say powerful ghost can take over the body who has died without any wound or something. It’s a practice in India – never left the dead body alone. Pishacha can take over the body, reanimate it and take it away. It’s a common knowledge here. This danger is always there.

Remember: life is cruel – why the afterlife should be otherwise?

SHAILENDRA SHARMA MAKING THIS STATEMENT FOR THE FIRST TIME

You mentioned such types of immortal beings, who don't even need spirit to be immortal?

Guruji: Ok, this is something extraordinary: you see, everybody, whoever is there is – we need jiva or spirit for life; for animation for life. That means your whole existence continues to depend on a spirit, which will bring life for an allocated time span and will take it away. What is emancipation, or nirvana, or liberation? When you have reached the source of life and you’re taking in life directly and you don’t need any carrier to bring you life. That is the state of liberation, mukta: you don’t need any spirit or atma to remain alive. This is the highest form of achievement. Second level achievement is: somehow you create some interest in your spirit, which is already billions of years old, and somehow you establish communication: and it agrees to remain inside your physical body, which we described in Gorakhbodh. But that one, who's directly taking life from the source, doesn't need any carrier to bring it to you- so you can live for some time. I think all those great people – 9 Naths and Avadhut- they have gone beyond that.

And Matsyendranath also?

Guruji: I think so, yes

What happens with the spirit after yogi connects with the source of life?

Guruji: It is their job: to bring life and take it away. But once you’re connected – you are respected and you’re independent, finally.

But the spirit remains inside?

Guruji: No, no need at all! Directly tacking in.

But the spirit goes somewhere after that?

Guruji: in their own home, wherever they live. It’s something absolutely new; and Shailendra Sharma making this statement for the first time. It is not recorded in human history. But I don’t think many people will even understand that. We will need more discussion on that.

Nirvana is a different state?

Guruji: Nirvana is when you decide to merge in the Void by leaving behind the immortal body. If there is no immortality- then the question on nirvana is not there.

It's like different paths: nirvana and merging with the Earth?

Guruji: Not exactly; two sides of a coin. Thus the description may differ, but it is more or less similar.

In both cases we have no spirit?

Guruji: You've gone beyond the need of a spirit. Immortal body will come: otherwise you will have no choice.

So on what it depends?

Guruji: It depends on your decision. You will be in a deciding situation.

That is something!

Guruji: Yes, it is big.

ANVOPAYA

35. INDISCRETION ABOUT REAL TRUTH BY THE DEGREES IS ILLUSION

Guruji: there is one truth; but we are trying to understand it from our own level of understanding which may not always be right. So it will be illusion.

could it be the real truth?

Guruji: to realise the real truth you need to have the extraordinary awareness and understanding. Otherwise you will just see the one small angle of the whole truth.

could we apply here to have no ambitions to awake our consciousness?

Guruji: no, it’s not applicable here. How many people you have come across who were ambitious enough to awaken their consciousness? Only here we maybe talking too much about it. Otherwise – devotion to god, surrendering yourself to god, - that is enough.

40. ONE WHO AWAKENES BECOMES LIKE A SON

Guruji: yes! Of Shiva.

I think it’s about the relationship of the spirit and the mind…

Guruji: no, of Shiva! Usually people translate “ dvitiya” as “second”; but if you look at the Sanskrit dictionary it also means the son.

does the spirit became the knower of the Time? Of his source, of his origin?

Guruji: maybe Shiva let it knows about the Time; it is your mind who will know about it.

and only then atma will be like a son of Shiva?

Guruji: the mind! You will be like a son of Shiva. Then the final exorcism will take place and you will be no longer possessed by your own spirit. You will have absolutely independent existence. That’s why ghosts are trying to possess you: because we’re possessed by our own atma.

49. HIS ACHIEVEMENT IS TO MAKE RULES FOR HIMSELF

Guruji: when you’re absolutely independent – only you can make rules for yourself. If you need them.

is it true that such a person could create a new Universe without any karmic consequences?

Guruji: yes.

is it similar with the state when we’re dreaming and we’re waking up -there is no consequences of the dream?

Guruji: for such a person everything will be like the same. Dreaming or awaking – all are same to him: because all his dreams has been fulfilled. In Yogini Hridaya tantra they write very great thing: after you have walked for hours and miles and miles and after that you sit down – that feeling can be compared with samadhi. They say: if you will go down to that feeling – you may enter samadhi.

50. EXISTENCE IS ETERNAL BUT LIFE HAS AN END

Guruji: existence is eternal but life has an end because what we see: life in between birth and death - this is what we considered as life. But you were existing before taking birth and you will continue to exist before you’re no longer there or you’re dead.

So life is only between birth and death; beyond that – eternal existence.

Maybe to feel that particular sentence of Time we take birth and experience life. That’s why Swatmarama writes: body is a sentence of time, kaal danda. We experience a limited time here. Otherwise it’s eternal.

how much times the Universe was destroyed and reborn again?

Guruji: Hindus says – countless times. You cannot count it. And they say – there are so many Universes that no one can count. From the smallest particle inside – it’s a Universe and from micro to macro – everywhere. You should read Yoga Vasishtha! Only Hindus are writing such a great tings which are beyond heaven and hell.

so the purpose maybe different from person to person?

Guruji: because the motive is different!

so for someone maybe knowing the Time is the purpose?

Guruji: in fact, since we start to talking about Time – then this thing has come up. Otherwise previously you will never find any mentioning that somebody want to know the Time. We have never come across any reference like that. But now we will have many people, trying to know the Time. And even knowing the Time will be just another step in self- realization: now I’m knowing the Time. That will make your self- realization far more bigger than you anticipate. Maybe one day you will say – yes, I am I.

but now I’m here – I don’t know about it anything before; what is it if not the choice?

Guruji: maybe it’s your destiny. Even in destiny we have not much choice.

also we can decide – to do something or not?

Guruji: most of our destiny is developing with the decisions we take just by chance. Soul- is just another name for your body.

when I die – soul connects with the spirit?

Guruji: no. I will give you very disturbing thought. When person baptizing to Christianity – he surrenders his soul to some unknown god. He signs the contract by drinking the blood of jesus – symbolically. What does it mean? It means you’re allowing them to do certain things with your body after your death. Nobody is talking about spirit. Last rituals in all religions are different. Nobody cares about the spirit.

The word “soul” has german origin and it means “ which is bound in death”. Only your physical body is bound in death, your spirit is immortal. And by doing certain rituals with the dead body they might be able to control the spirit. Every magician knows this. That is the main difference between yoga and religion: in religion you are taught to pray to some unknown god – whom you don’t know, but learn from some book or by some preachers – and if the god will be pleased – he will allow you to go to heaven; if he is angry – he will throw you to hell.

Only yoga teaches you, how to make your own spirit your friend: because spirit is going from the other side – he will give you true wisdom, what is on other side. And if it become your friend – then it will live very long life inside your physical body. That is principle of yoga. It’s a big difference. Yoga is not against religion – but it is not religion.

Is it safe to say that the souls are moving to the realm of pure consciousness after death, not returning back to sansaric circles?

Guruji: Yes, we can say that sansaric circle engages only 2% of our brain. Otherwise it is just a play; most of the ancient texts call it “ lila” . Just a play. We have Ram Lila and Krishna Lila also, beside the Lila of the creation.

again to the topic of Rama, Ravana, Arjuna Kartavirya – can we reach that level or the spirit must be born like this?

Guruji: you were sportsmen – you know, how much depends on genetics. Ravana genetics were very special – he was the direct descendant of the creator and the son of rishi. They were very special and then they did great tapas to develop themselves – all their superpowers. Rama’s genetics was also extraordinary – he was an avatar, Parabrahman Parameshwar. It was the clash of the titans.

so for us it’s not possible to be like Shiva Himself?

Guruji: no one has been able to achieve that.

what is the ceiling for human being?

Guruji: to attain liberation from all your problems and begin the deciding position. If you will be able to decide your own future, your own destiny – whatever you want to be.

after that can we decide to be superpowerful being?

Guruji: yes, it is possible. Read my commentaries: you can be one with the Time – but you cannot be Time itself. You can be one with Time – even this much is very big thing. It’s a big game – let’s play!

Illusion of freedom.

… I give some chocolate for my monkey; she was very happy in her cage – the food is coming, water, then I remember – what is happened to the monkey, who are free? They roaming here and there to save themselves, no food, no shelter. Because she was in bondage – she was enjoying. The illusion of freedom may be also bondage.

Q: I have seen the awful picture, when the tiger was lying in the cage near the piece of meat, even not looking at it…

Guruji: do you know what happen with tiger in jungle, when he’s growing old? He starve and die from hunger. Because they are too old to hunt, and there is nobody to take care of them because they are free. In the cage he also dies, but there was a doctor, looking after him. You can be free only if you stop your breathe: you will be roaming in the space – you don’t need any food or something.