Other teachers and sects: Ramakrishna, Vivekananda, Osho, Aurobindo, Castaneda, Buddhist lineages

Speaking about Carlos Castaneda I can say that his practice not self enough. They will make you contact with certain forces of nature and also remember Dondvan the guru of Carlos Castaneda, worship in Datura (Indian medical plant – editor’s note) . You know datura which is a certain plant offered to Shiva and in Sanskrit its name is also shiv and it has got so many supernatural property. That is more near to the American Indian wave. But books by Carlos Castaneda were interesting and also what I expected. The death always accompanies the person. When you look at the situation suddenly you will see something that is also a fact. This practice is real. It is like nature worship, the connection with devils of the nature. And the practices described in the first edition of Elisa Bailey’s book about white magic are much higher and more spiritual in nature. In Bhagavad Gita it is written that you have to be good with your enemies. Actually the science is that you should not feel anger towards your enemy, neither love, nor anger. Keep your mind steady only then you can fight with them. This is the basic theory of any Marshall arts – Kung fu, karate. If you are angry it will affect you and you will lose so the mind should be very steady without anger. Then only you can hope to fight well and win.

Three persons went to USA: and their names became the legends of their time. Swami Vivekananda – he is a legend; then Yogananda Paramahamsa: everybody knows him – his organization; and he was the key person, introduced Kriya yoga and lineage of Gurus and Babaji to the whole world. Then third Bengali – Shrila Prabhupada went: and people started to be vegetarians and became to be devotees of Shri Krishna and Radha. This is fantastic story!

Q; but nevertheless America is going down and destroying itself

Guruji: well, this is the destiny of every empire: all of them came to the end. Nothing lasts forever. Maybe ShrilaPrabhupada was really full of devotion; Swami Vivekananda had the grace of his Guru – Ramakrishna Paramahamsa and Goddess Kali; Yogananda Paramahamsa had also blessing from Babaji and Kali was also blessing him. ShrilaPrabhupada had direct grace from Krishna and Radha – I have no doubt about it. He was not having six packs or biceps like Arnold – but look, what he did. And he did it after his retirement: that is amazing – he was very old, when he went there. He was living in Vrindavan and he came back to Vrindavan and died in Mathura. His hut is still there: ISCKON people are maintaining that. I’ve visited it – it’s a good place.

he died in awful condition, as I remember?

Guruji: he died remembering Krishna – that is enough. We have saying: if your body is not healthy – no matter, your mind should remain healthy.

Q; I think it’s a big problem – never seen like that.

Guruji: average person keep criticising everyone – from god to their father and every politician: they keep on criticising everybody.

But it requires a very open-minded person and hard-working person, who is trying to achieve something in life and who achieved: only he can appreciate what otherperson before he becoming great – what he went through. We need to learn from them and we have to respect them also. Simplest thing is to criticise god or your prime minister or your president; but I’ve never ever heard anybody criticising mafia boss. I think they are all legends: Swami Vivekananda, Yogananda Paramahamsa and Shrila Prabhupada. I don’t think anyone else became that famous or created such big evolutionary thing.

but Paramahamsa Yogananda started from very high level?

Guruji: he was born in the family of disciples of LahiriMahasaya, he was surrounded by disciples – he was exposed to Kriya Yoga from early childhood.

he started from the very high point – but he created an organization?

Guruji: if you will not create organization – Americans will not even listen to you. Maybe it was for that: while in Rome – dress like romans do; so while in America – he did like Americans do.

Prabhupada was from Vaishnav family – Gaudia Vaishnav he was already; then he became a monk after his retirement; he was married and had children also. Then he became a sannyasi and devoted all energy to whatever purpose he want – and he was successful.

and Vivekananda?

Guruji: he died very early – 39 years of age. His organization is the biggest in India: Ramakrishna’s mission. They created fantastic schools and hospitals – maybe thousands of them. Everybody may not be hankering to see god face to face – but everybody needs education and help, when they are sick; so it’s a big service started and others are also doing it.

why they moved to the United States but not to Europe?

Guruji: because America was a democratic country then. Nearly 200 years it was the only democracy in the world- otherwise monarchy was ruling. We need to consider the fact, that you had freedom of expression in America in those days– and maybe even today. It was democracy – and all other countries were under monarchy. It was the safe way to go and to do it there. Because all these things will become democratic main theme: yoga, devotion, following religion – we all have freedom of expression. We have the saying in India that there is always a shadow under the lamp. My take on this is: who wants to remove that shadow under the lamp – you have tolight another lamp at a distance: that light will remove that shadow under the lamp. These three legends did that – and came back to India. We were under british rule then – you have no freedom of expression, nothing. Those days they went to America and started such a big thing; I think ShrilaPrabhupada went after India was liberated.

and Osho: he created huge organization?

Guruji: yes, but he failed in USA. He is a legend in his own way – but you cannot compare him to these three.

but I think among the common people he is the most popular?

Guruji: among the common people in India – no. But the respect, which Swami Vivekananda, Yogananda Paramahamsaand Shrila Prabhupada commanded… Osho is open for criticism – very controversial figure; even though he was an intellectual giant, that goes without saying. But his approach was not to grassroots level people – only rich. And all these three had a very grassroots level approach. I don’t think any big controversies was connected with these three – Vivekananda, Yogananda and Shrila Prabhupada.

maybe the mission of these three was to show the world the alternative of jesus?

Guruji: in fact, it was hardcore Christian times in US then. Ku Klux Clan, Lynch and all other things were happening: that was not the very easy thing for Yogananda. Vivekananda visited it 2-3 times – but his main work started in India. I think Vivekananda got a lot of resistance from hardcore Christians. Maybe Prabhupada also. But they didn’t talk much about it, they let it buried.

SAMADHI AND SADHANA OF SPIRITUAL LEADERS

“Nirvikalpa”: the literal translation of the word is “no more options”, without options. So when you have started a big movement and you have created something big and you have been leading it – you have no other option but to go on. In that sense – he(Yogananda) was in nirvikalpa state.

This is quite an uncompromising comment…undoubtedly, if you’re leading some kind of religious school, if you are leading a philosophical group, if you are leading society – your day is packed?

Guruji: your day is packed, you’re not free to leave.

your obligations which you created on your own!

And if you were given these instructions – to go and start something: in this case, in case of Yogananda?

Guruji: There are still a lot of controversy. But he was successful: that is that.

What do you think about such leaders as Dalay-lama and the Pope – those are people of God, but those people are busy with administrative functions first of all?

Guruji : they are political leaders.

They are; but are they still religious leaders?

Guruji: their identity is based on religion: they cannot be separated from it. Their whole identity is based on religion.

and the quality of their prayers and meditation is something we leave to them to tell us…. As a suspicion goes – well, there are good people, great people, who inspired many; but as for their real sadhana: do they really have time to do?

Guruji: I don’t think so. They are not even interested in that.

GURUJI ABOUT J. KRISHNAMURTI

Do you know J. Krishnamurti?

Guruji: I’ve read most of his books, yes. My humble observation is: always look at the roots of the person. Blavatsky, Annie Besant and the Theosophical Society were training him to be the Buddha Maitreya, the next incarnation — and he simply refused, and the organization ended with him; he dissolved it. No matter how much philosophy you keep talking for the goodness of humanity. From a very grassroots point of view, it was a withdrawal from his mentors.

So you think…

Guruji: I’m thinking nothing — I’m just pointing out the obvious. I’m not giving any opinion on it. What I’m saying: if someone is too philosophical and talking very nicely — you always check out his background.

We don’t know about it.

Guruji: Oh, it’s widespread information now, even on Google. They chose him very carefully with all his astrological things, and they were training him to be the next incarnation of Buddha Maitreya; and he was trained from his early childhood. So whatever he is saying — “you don’t need a Guru for anything” — it was wrong; he himself was trained. They made him an international name also. He didn’t just suddenly appear out of the blue and become famous.

What was the aim of training?

Guruji: That the spirit of the Buddha Maitreya would descend inside him — like the Holy Spirit descended into Jesus Christ. It was a big plan. If you have been trained by such powerful theosophical people, you naturally go through many experiences: you’re trained for that. But he was the cause of the organization’s disappearance. But I’ve read most of his books.

I like him so much, that’s why I’m asking…

Guruji: His talks are good, no doubt. But I’m a practical man — and I’m pointing out the practical background also. You must consider that also. See, everybody is talking good; who is not talking good?

In my opinion his talks are hard to understand.

Guruji: That’s why they are called philosophical talks: what you don’t understand — you just label it as philosophical.

what do You think of that creatures about Castaneda wrote – which spirits has the triangular or square shape?

Guruji: sphere is a final thing: everything is part of it; even a triangle will finally form a sphere.

You think he saw some spirits like that?

Guruji: we also saw some spirits like square and triangle – but the general shape is round. Even here in photos some squares and triangles have appeared. It depends on the standard of the spirit.

why he called them inorganic?

Guruji: he knew only that Don Huan was teaching him – and there are some half-truth mostly. Remember, red indian will never be a friend of white man.

he was like Buddha – to create confusion and transfer it to the masses?

Guruji: half-truth is more dangerous than real truth. Real truth will give you peace. Half-truth will create so many confusions. It is like carrot hanging in front of the donkey.

Geometrical forms are the symbols of elements: triangle is of fire, square of earth, etc.

Two lines from Kabir: maya didn’t die, the mind didn’t die, but so many bodies died. And the thirst for something and hope – they didn’t die. That is what Kabir says.

The main goal of yoga practice is to achieve Samadhi. Then use Samadhi for get the real knowledge and wisdom. Then finally you will awaken 100% of your mind. That is the main goal.

RAMAKRISHNA PARAMAHAMSA

some times back we discussed Naga baba and You said they are like the guards?

Guruji: they do very difficult penance and they used to be like a guardians of all other sadhus. There were many historical records of them saving so many different pilgrimages, sadhus and they provide so many things. They are like fighter- sadhus.

they discipline are different from yoga practice?

Guruji: some of them were very accomplished yogis: the Guru of Ramakrishna Paramahamsa – Totapuri Maharaj. He was Naga sadhu, but he was able to grant nirvikalpa samadhi to Ramakrishna Paramahamsa. Some of them are extraordinarily spiritually developed.

is it true that he granted him samadhi in 72 hours?

Guruji: that is true.

how Ramakrishna Paramahamsa’s body could tolerate such state?

Guruji: he couldn’t tolerate – he died 52. But their work was different, their mission was different. There are many great people in Naga baba.

what kind of practice was given to Ramakrishna Paramahamsa – it was some mantra or it was some yoga technics?

Guruji: every Bengali brahmin – they know about the mantras mostly and he belonged to a priest family. His elder brother were still priest in that Kali temple, Dakshineshwar Kali. First a woman seen him, which is called Brahmani. She was very much accomplished in tantra, she knew all 64 tantras and she taught all those tantras to Ramakrishna Paramahamsa. And after her teachings were over- then finally Totapuri came, the Naga baba, who granted him final samadhi. Kali was taking care of him. the whole temple was built for Ramakrishna’s tapas – so he will attain what he may to attain. Absolute new temple, new statue of Kali – everything. That creation was only for Ramakrishna and teacher came to him, he never went anywhere – that is the grace of the Mother.

he has two Gurus: what happened with him after death – to whom he came?

Guruji: to Kali directly – it was all arrangement from Kali. His example is only one. No other example like Ramakrishna Paramahamsa – when the goddess herself arranged everything for him. first time the temple was build, everything was absolutely new, and he lived there and accomplished so great spiritual heights – that was the direct grace from Kali. She was arranging everything. She pulled even teachers for him. it is like a mother arranging tutor’s for her child. That is fantastic story.

how he can learn all tantras – I thought these knowledge are for after yoga practice achievements?

Guruji: he was already entering into samadhi since he was a child. He was extraordinary born. They say his first samadhi happen when he was visiting some farm land; he was living in Kamarpukur – very small village, all fields around. It was raining – then it stopped; there were some light and some clouds – and a line of hansa or some birds – they flew. By just looking at them he went into samadhi. He was a spiritual giant.

do You know another example, who was the knower of 64 tantras – except Matsyendranath?

Guruji: no, only Ramakrisnha – by the grace of that Brahmani. And nobody knows where she went after teaching him. these things remain a mystery.

what about that 5 types of trees, which Ramakrishna planted in Dakshineshwar temple?

Guruji: yes, they called panchvati – you used to meditate sitting there. He only meditating there; now people just coming, do their pranam and that’s it. The whole area was for him, whole creation was specially for him. banyan, bael, amalaka, ashoka and peepul.

he was practicing advayta mantra?

Guruji: I think he was already beyond technics. That mantra - Tat Tvam Asi – is normal foe every sadhu, every sadhu is chanting it. But there is some more mystery: whatever they described may not be the whole truth. Nobody is describing 64 tantras in detail, nowhere – just some superficial things. What was planned – he was graced by Kali, she was taking very good care of him. that’s the beauty: if Mother is taking very good care of you – you have no problem.

that 64 tantras – they are like arts or like texts like Kularnava tantra?

Guruji: nobody exactly knows, what it is. Maybe 64 yoginis are the presiding deities for 64 tantras. Nobody knows from where Brahmani came and where she went – nowhere mentioned. Totapuri also. When I was in Puri – there was a place, people said that Totapuri was living here. I went there – but it was not feeling like that.

TIBETAN PRACTICES

what do You think about the Tibetan technic of tumo – when the heat of the body is increasing and they could tolerate any frost?

Guruji: see, most of the technics which are described in Tibetan books – secret talked in Tibetan yoga or even mentioned – the technics are very similar to what we are practicing. Not too big difference. Tumo, tuva – they are Tibetan names given what they learn from India. In Kriya yoga they are all part of it.

six yogas of Naropa also?

Guruji: yes, Tilopa and Naropa: Marpa learned and then gave it to his disciples.

so the technics are the same as in Kriya?

Guruji: there have been selected and tibetanised there – but the basic principles remain the same. But I see now – they may be not done exactly as they are written. I have seen maybe 200 tibetan lamas: they were not looking if they know these technics or they are practicing them. Milarepa was the real master and maybe some lamas; after that we don’t see anymore. Not many lamas are leading the lifestyle of Milarepa. they possess their talk: they are called “repas”. Maybe it’s no longer there.

but Milarepa started his career as a warlock or magician?

Guruji: as a magician: he killed all his enemies and then; his life is worth reading.

what is your opinion about Kastaneda teachings?

Guruji: he was red indian, who was tortured very brutally by white people. I think he just mislead Karlos Kastaneda and all others. He gives half-tools, not the whole things. Suppose one thing: imagine that some negroes killed all your nation, your friends, your family, and after some time their descendant come to you and ask you for teachings. What will you say to him?

understand. But is this some rational in his books? As for me the conscious dreams was very interesting .

Guruji: some things- yes. Most of the red Indians used certain herbs to dream consciously or to go out of the body. They had very spiritual knowledge and they were very sensitive to nature.

so is it the right path or not?

Guruji: he never give the whole keys to the white men. You have to be careful with the spiritual knowledge. I told you as a Guru: read every book that comes to you and then discuss with me or with someone whose opinion you are respect and only then draw some conclusions.

Guruji, what do you think about Devraha Baba?

Guruji: I know about him. He was sadhu. And his Guru’s name is unknown. He was not belonging to any yogi lineage. Always look at the lineage – that’s the point.

GURUJI ABOUT AUROBINDO

He had such a talent( story about Gulab Singh ): he could write both hands and he could copy any signature. He copied british governor’s signature and took out 200000 rupees from british bank. Out of that he gave 170000 rupees to Rash Bihari Bose; he went to Japan and created there the Indian historical thing. And with 30000 rupees he came back to his village. Then Aurobindo set in Pondicherry permanently; and he came back to his village and never did anything after that.

Someone inform the police and he was arrested. Most of the things were confiscated, including the certificate from Queen Victoria – that colonel Gulab Singh has the quality of the soldier. Conqueror of the freedom war: 1892 of gun war- he was commandeering chief of the horse cavaliere. They were trying – but nobody could proof, that this signatures are fake.

People keep missing the point that Aurobindo learn yoga from Vishno Bhaskar Lele: he was the yogi from Gwalior. Also he receive some mantras from very high Naga baba. Read about his life and you will find it.

but he started all the descriptions from Samadhi?

Guruji: they were just about something.

it was not his own experience?

Guruji: maybe; two Ghosh died most the same time – Paramahamsa Yogananda and Aurobindo Ghosh; both their bodies remain without corruption for a very long time after death. Simply we can agree that they were spiritual giants. Yogananda created something, very systematic teachings; Aurobindo was talking about it – but no systematic teaching: only the followers – he has no disciples.

could his high state be the result of the teachings of that Naga baba?

Guruji: it’s a combination: Vishno Bhaskar taught him yoga and mantra from Naga baba he was practicing.

what do You think – it was his mission or the followers just gather around his personality?

Guruji: when you’re doing something very seriously spiritual and you’re too deep into it – followers will gather around. No matter either you’re very deep in the jungle or at the peaks of Himalayas – somebody will find you there. Because he was born in the 15 th of august – it became the independence day of India. You cannot discard it just like coincidence.

we were at his ashram in Pondicherry – but I feel nothing there…

Guruji: he is gone. Soon it will be underwater, the level is rising. All the coast area will be drown.

how far it will go?

Guruji: I think 4-6 kilometers – maybe even more.

so better to visit Venice now?

Guruji: Venice will vanish.

why exactly that place for the ashram?

Guruji: he was accusative, british police was trying to arrest him; and that area was under French control, so he escaped there.

is it known something about his Guru from Gwalior?

Guruji: nobody knows; he taught him some yoga – that’s it. What yoga – he never deciphered.

SWAMI VIVEKANANDA STORY

Swami Vivekananda was very famous.

Swami Vivekananda was staying with the King of Khetri — it is a very famous story. But one day he went to the court, and there was an arrangement for a dance by a prostitute.

Swamiji, because he was a monk, turned away. And she was hurt. Then she started to sing a bhajan: “It is not my fault that I am this way; God created me like this.”

Swami Vivekananda became very emotional. He touched her feet and said, “Mother, please bless me.”

She blessed him.

And the rest is history. He became the most famous Swami from India. He openly received a blessing from a prostitute in the king’s court.

Always be careful and respectful.

So we should learn from these examples. And we all knew this story, but this thing that I told about Hanuman Ji — my Guru told me in Benares. He also knew many things like that.

What do you think about sukshma vyayama in the tradition of Dhirendra Brahmachari?

A: Dhirendra Brahmachari was a good yogi. And I think he went to Russia also. I have good thoughts about him, but he is not longer there. He was an expert in yoga postures and in so many other things.

what do you think about yoga postures what he was giving?

A: all yoga postures create a different body language which will directly affect your consciousness and your mind and your brain. So yoga postures in any form will actually affect your consciousness. I’m very much okay with that. You just need to be sincere in whatever you are doing.

what can You tell about Telang Swami?

Guruji: I’m sure he was the part of Babaji’s group; he came to Benares before Lahiri Mahasaya was born. He was like the godfather to him – always observing, always supporting and showing openly very miraculous things; he telling that – you go to Shyamacharan Lahiri – that’s why king went to him. It was like the teamwork. That is also on record, that Telang Swami took food only from father-in-law in Lahiri Mahasaya’s house, nowhere else. He also give the mantra to future wife of Lahiri Mahasaya. It was the very mysterious teamwork.

it possible that Telang Swami also took birth – but real was a nath yogi?

Guruji: nobody knows; he was living always naked, showed miraculous powers openly and he was more than 300 years old. He actually didn’t die: he simply said – I’m going into Samadhi, put me in the wooden box and let me flow with Ganges. We don’t know – he came out from Samadhi and went somewhere else. We never found out that. It was very easy for him – he was just dive inside the Ganges and surfaced after 8 or 10 hours – it was not a problem for him. He will go without food for months and drink big quantities of milk and curd maybe 20 or 30 liters. Maybe he was the last siddha, who appeared and displayed his powers openly; after Telang Swami I don’t see anybody of that level.

Many people are talking about god and philosophy - the whole India is full of them, maybe the whole world is full of them – but to be able to do these extraordinary supernatural things – after Telang Swami I don’t think anyone is even near him.

could be Telang Swami Babaji himself?

Guruji: physically he looked very different. But such great beings have enough power to change their appearance anytime. We can not be sure about it.

is it possible to use two or more bodies simultaneously?

Guruji: anything is possible. For such beings no natural laws applies, they are already beyond – so we can not be sure of anything.

As a yogi – now in a serious note – how you will actually assess Ramana Maharshi?

before coming to you I read many of his books

Guruji: according to kula, kulachara of yogis: a person without Guru is not considered as a yogi. No Guru – that’s a point. There is a word for them: nigura – without Guru.

I hear that Osho was the champion on debates in India?

Guruji: actually he never debated face to face with anyone. He was just giving lectures, and in his own lectures he was challenging so many people but nobody came to him. He never went to somebody to discuss. There is no debate; I don’t think there is any recorded debate where Osho went and debated with someone. He was sitting in one place, in the beginning he was moving around and the big crowds were gathering for his lectures. He was talking in the very good way – very entertaining, there were some deep thoughts in his talks, but there was no face to face debate. Another point: no Guru also. First he was Acharya Radjnish, then he became Bhagavan Rajnish, then – Osho. It is name in Japanese for some master or genie. And the Guru’s name of Devraha Baba is also not known.

what do you think – he did some rituals to attain some siddhi?

Guruji: he may have done something, but again – parampara is missing. No Guru. It is not a yoga discipline. It creates sensation, everybody loves to watch magic.

I don’t understand why philosophers are writing commentaries on yoga texts? Vivekananda, Osho…

Guruji: Vivekananda never wrote the comments to Hatha Yoga Pradipika, and there were some lectures on Yoga Sutras in America. He was the first sannyasi, who went to this religious conference, then he became very famous in India because to become famous aboard was very big thing. In my opinion, Vivekananda was the most impressive looking sannyasi of India. I’ve never see anyone equal to him. He stands upon, he’s the most handsome and impressive looking sannyasi. And he has great knowledge also, and I’m sure - his Guru’s blessings was on him and Kali’s blessings was. And Ramakrishna Paramahamsa Guru’s name is known to us. He was Tota Puri, naga sadhu.

he achieved Samadhi state?

Guruji : it was granted to him by Ramakrishna Paramahamsa. There is no doubt about their greatness. There was one big land owner, she was called queen – Rani Rasmani. She was not of the high caste, but she had enough money and she was like a queen. She wanted to make a temple of Kali. But there was a technical problem, that as a lower caste she can’t build a temple. So she was searching around and her son-in-law – Mathura prabhu, was able to contact the elder brother of Ramakrishna Paramahamsa – very great scholar and a pandit of that area. He told her a way, how to make Kali temple without any problems. He said – you just build the temple in the name of your Kula Guru, which was a very technical thing, - and she did it successfully. Ramakrishna Paramahamsa was showing the symptoms of bhava Samadhi from very early childhood. He were going to bhava even in the age of 4-5. And the blood brother did some conditions that he will continue to be the main priest and his descendants will be continue to be the main priests of the temple. She was agree – and I think, they are still there. When he came to the temple to take charge of all the pujas – Ramakrishna Paramahamsa was also brought with him. That tells me, that he was the very great devotee of Kali. And maybe for his final attainment Kali herself arranged everything for Ramakrishna Paramahamsa to attain perfectioning devotion. Absolute new temple – everything were created for Ramakrishna Paramahamsa. It is the very important observation, because as I was telling you a story about that woodcutter, - that situation was created for him. Same situation was created for Ramakrishna Paramahamsa – it was an ancient cremation grounds near and absolute new temple of Kali came up, and the Guru also came to him. Two Gurus came: it was one woman, brahmani, she was the great knower of tantras – she taught him tantras and helped him; and then Tota Puri maharaj came – he granted him a miracle Samadhi. Kali arranged everything for Ramakrishna Paramahamsa – that is enough for me to say that he was the one of the greatest devotees of Kali of that time.

for me it’s very look like your situation: when yogin achieves Rudra granthi – smashan coming to him?

Guruji: I will be very happy if it is true. Somehow it looks similar.

But I say – comparatively it is easier to please the Mother, to please the Father is a big problem. It’s not easy to please the Father.

Guruji, what do you think about Aurobindo?

Guruji: he was the very great yogi, and I will also compare him with Paramahamsa Yogananda. Aurobindo Ghosh, and Paramahamsa Yogananda’s family name was Mukunda Lal Ghosh – they were both Ghosh. And two Ghosh died near the same time and both their bodies remain without any changes for a long time; Yogananda’s body was there for 21 days, and Aurobindo’s body remain more than hundred hours: and the golden blue light was seen around his body. And if you look at them both very carefully: there are pictures available when they were young and when they were old – they became very beautiful as they growing old. This is the sign of genuine spirituality.

but Aurobindo was saying that Samadhi must be at first – and then dhyana and all the steps: for what it’s about?

Guruji: actually nobody knows, what he was practicing. But he came in contact with some naga sadhus and there was one yogi from my hometown –Vishnu Bhaskar Lele - he taught him yoga and some meditation things which he did – and he himself said, that yes, he learned from him. And also there is hypothesis so when he was revolted against the british rule – he stayed with one school headmaster, who was a disciple of Panchanan Bhattacharya, who was the prominent disciple of Shri Shyamacharan Lahiri – so this headmaster - his name was Barada Charan Majumdar - was the very advanced Kriya Yogi and Aurobindo Ghosh was in his touch. He taught Subash Chand Bose and Kazi Nazrul Islam yoga, and when Aurobindo Ghoshcame to his house to hide himself during the freedom war he was also taught by him. It is stand to reason because it is a secret sign that maybe Aurobindo Ghosh learned something from Barada Charan Majumdar - his lifestyle indicates towards it. Because great master of Kriya Yoga – Yogananda Paramahamsa – leave his body consciously, and his body remains without any decay or corruption for 21 days; same thing happened with Aurobindo Ghosh for more than 100 hours – it stand to reason to theorize that they were doing almost the same thing – so same result. And they both became beautiful as they were growing old. And I’m very proud to inform you, that Aurobindo Ghosh was close friend of my grandfather. He was among them who revolted against british rules. At those times my grandfather by making false signature of the governor of Kolkatta - he withdraw 200000 rupees from british bank. He gave 170000 rupees to the man who went to Japan to start these assassin force which lay down some boss to coma. Those time he was very closely associated with Aurobindo Ghosh also. And when Aurobindo Ghosh left everything and went to Pondicherry saying that revolution is not good and my grandfather came back to his village with 30000 rupees that was not a bad amount of that days – somebody informed the police and he was arrested also; but britishers could not prove, that he is guilty. He was released clean, and when he was coming out he said the police that – I’m same Gulab Singh who did that – here I go. He was lucky man. And they have a lot of discussion about Aurobindo Ghosh when I was extremely young. They were friends. But he died before me taking birth. All the records of my family are keeping in the village, and such people called jaga – record-keepers.

do you think that history, when Ramakrishna was trying to explain Samadhi – he fell down in it, is it true?

Guruji: yes, I believe in it, because he was in very high emotionally state of devotion. These things are known to happen. But he was born to complete something, which was arranged by Kali herself for him – anyone could see that. Maybe our destiny is different. I think great people come to fulfill some of what is left them to do to achieve something. Their ishta devata and Guru lineage supports them, and when they finish whatever they came to do and they go away – humanity is left to create the stories about them, create some organization around their names. See the organization around Jesus Christ. Same thing with Ramakrishna also. Maybe it also decreed by some higher powers that their names will be remembered for a long time. Living in smashan and finding svayambhu Shivalingam is unique – we tried to find some examples like this and failed. Next month we complete the eighteen years.

what do you think about Shankaracharya?

Guruji: if you read his life – there is no record of him becoming a yogi or practicing yoga. His Guru was living in the central India and he was showing miracles from the very early age, when he was 5-6 years old.

what kind of miracles?

Guruji: he stopped the flood of the river, he made the golden things fell from the sky – there were some magical displays.

and these golden things remain golden?

Guruji: yes, it was amalaki – and they remain gold. From the very early childhood he was displaying the miracle things.

Person is not remembered of he was a nice man or gentleman – he was remembered by his miracles. Nobody wants to remember a nice man, because a nice man is boring man – no interesting things come. Or maybe he’s nice because he’s coward also. The story will sound very boring: long life he was a nice man, he was born as a nice boy, he grew up to be nice student, then he was married to a nice woman, they were in love with each other and some nice children were born and then he grew to be very nice old man and he died very nice death and was buried by very nice people, nicely; - who would like to read this story? No drama, no tragedy, no action, nothing.

If you want an example – I can give an example: Swami Vivekananda. He was living as a guest of the king of Khetri somewhere in Rajasthan. He was young and he died very young… One day he went to the court and there was a prostitute dancing. Swami Ji stopped and started to go back; and the prostitute noticed it and began to sing a bhajan: that I am what God has made me, there is no fault of mine that I’m a prostitute. Tears came into Swami Ji’s eyes, he kneeled down in front of her, touched her feet and called her: Ma, please, give me blessings! And she blessed him. See – he became internationally known after that. His life just took so many different turns and he’s remembered – he is a legendary figure. The blessing from the prostitute!

Very different from blessing from a politician?

Guruji: Of course. Prostitutes are more honored.

I think I’ve already told you the story of Trailang Swami? There was a very big flood in Benares; it was feared that Benares may be swept away by the fury of the Ganges flood. As they say – I heard it in Benares – the king of Benares went to Trailang Swami, he was very famous, known as the living Shiva of Benares. And Swami said – ok, go to a woman, who has never thought of another man in her life; if she will say that “I’ve never thought of another man – o, please, Ganges, control your anger!” So the king announced that – but no woman came forward even if she may not have thought of another man. If nothing happens – then she will have an effect on the whole of her life. The king again went to Trailang Swami; he said – ok, I’ll come. There was a very old prostitute, living in Chawk bazar, where there was a colony of prostitutes. He went and told her that; she began to weep – that I’m randee, I’m a prostitute! He said: please, mother, come! She was brought into a palanquin and she just said these words that Trailang Swami told her – and the water began to recede immediately. And she died on the spot. She was already 90+.

Was it very hazardous to ask for such a thing?

Guruji: Who thinks of a prostitute? There is no existence of other men in her case. They have a very special type of power. If she curses a man or anybody – no one can remove it. If she blesses – the blessing will last forever.

I was after my mother to allow me to have some dogs -finally she agreed and I went to a friend of my uncle – please, give me puppies. They were about to come and he said, “only on one condition, you will feed them meat and cook them rice every day – otherwise I will not give you them”. I searched for meat shops and all these things. In Gwalior, there is a place called Chawri Bazar – it was a hardcore prostitute place and there some butchers were selling meat. I was in school then; and I was trying to bring home leftover meat from the butchers; and then some sweepers would come and cook it – nobody would touch it. After coming from school I would go to that place and bring about a half kg. of leftovers every day. One relative saw me, coming and going. After she observed me for a few days she complained to my father: You know? You must look at him, he’s not behaving well nowadays. Father asked: what happened? I’ve seen him going to the prostitute area and coming from there every day! Father said – ok, he’s going, but what were You doing there? (laughing) I was in ninth standard then.

but they have Milarepa, Tilopa and Naropa?

Guruji: remember, Tilopa and Naropa were supposed to be Nath yogins. At all pictures they are with all nath things. Milarepa was not exactly Buddhist, he was practicing yoga, learn from India – his Guru Marpa learn it. If you will read closely about their technics – you will find them very similar to Kriya yoga. Just open your mind for it. Simply giving them Tibetan name doesn’t mean that they are different. But the purity is lost, I’ve seen that.

why it happened – technics mixed with something else?

Guruji: local impact always come.

THOUSANDS STORYS - THOUSANDS LIFES

It was the great flood on Yamuna river and the temple went under water: he didn’t leave – he climbed the tree nearby and when the government officer went to rescue him – he said no, I’m ok here. He just take this “batasha” – it is made with sugar, about one palm; one batasha every day and he survived for more than 15 days sitting on this tree. He never left the place. When water receded – he came down the tree.

Q: "Why did Meera Bai take birth? Was it to set an example of some kind as she was a great devotee of God from a very early age?"

Guruji: "First of all, as she was born in a royal family she can't be regarded as an ordinary soul. It won't be wrong to say that her emotional state of mind was much heightened as compared to any ordinary person. And I strongly believe that the level of her devotion cannot happen without a direct experience of some kind. She definitely had some direct experience in her childhood. Only after a direct experience can the live of a person change so dramatically. You simply cannot cultivate this level of devotion. The way you cannot cultivate love, you cannot cultivate devotion. It just happens, and when such an extraordinary incident happens to somebody, history remembers them!

"Such experiences are always kept secret. She never propagated her experience. She just stayed in her bhava (divine emotion), and she is still remembered as a great soul. I really like her. Meerabai, Tulsidas, Soordas, all of them wrote extraordinary compositions. They suffered in life because of their devotion. People who fall in deep emotions, like Majnu, who fell deeply in love, may get ruined materially but still leave a deep impact. These people were not happy even on the family front. This is a striking similarity between Meera Bai and Tulsidas; Meera Bai’s husband Bhojraj died very early and she gave birth to a stillborn baby girl. These incidents in life must certainly have resulted in a lot of bottled-up emotions. Tulsidas’s wife used to mock him, and his son Tarapati died in his childhood. It was only after these incidents that their poetry truly developed rasa (taste, emotion) which was absolutely miraculous. These people certainly had seen God. It is impossible to become a poet of this level all of a sudden without a blessing from God.

"I never believed in these things earlier but after coming to Vraj (almost 11 years in Oct 2004), I have since realized that these divine mysteries we hear about do exist. There is truth in people seeing God or experiencing some kind of contact. An ordinary person can’t even imagine what those people must have seen or experienced. He’ll consider those men and women as crazy or insane.

"People who are at an advanced stage in Yoga practice experience it for sure, and even those people who have reached the zenith of any one emotion experience it as well. This is what we remark in India as kripa (blessing). Who confers it, to whom, when, and how it happens remains unknown. There are no set of rules to predict it. It’s just the matter of purity of heart.

"Now let's consider Chaitanya Mahaprabhu. He had an experience in Gaya when he was looking at the feet of lord Vishnu. After that, he got the darshan of lord Vishnu and Balram. People generally say these were divine visions, but I feel they were actually the experience of seeing God face to face (darshan). How amazing it is that the whole Vrindawan transformed into a vaishnava pilgrimage when Chaitanya Mahaprabhu arrived here! I would never believed it, but after living in Govardhan for a long time now, my awareness has definitely increased. I do feel it's true that when he used to do kirtan (sing devotional songs), the entire nature used to sing with him! Imagine the beauty around with the birds singing alongside with him and the trees dancing on his rhythm. The entire nature would get tuned to the melody of his devotion ("saara vatavaran kirtan-may ho jata tha") and sing alongside "Hare Rama Hare Krishna" with him. That effect can still be felt in and around Vraj."

So one out of the body lama was teaching Blavatskaya?

Guruji: This is what is written in her life.

But as I understand somehow the rules were changed and now after death no teacher is coming?

Guruji: Maybe they went back to the background — we don’t know exactly. But there were some very great minds part of it; like Anny Besant: she was a very great scientist and one of the pillars of Theosophical Society. They were just not religious fanatics; they were highly developed brains, very intelligent scientists. I think whatever they wrote in their books — it must be scientifically valid.

How such people without yoga practice could…

Guruji: No, they must be doing something. Not exactly yoga practice of Nath Yogis and what we are doing; but something.

For me it’s unbelievable how it is possible to be aware of all such things without a system?

Guruji: They called themselves “spiritualists” and they were into seances also: they invoked spirits and some very sensitive mediums or psychic ability people were able to see them.

Without any training?

Guruji: No, with a training. It is my Guru’s grace on me — that I can show aura to any of my disciples. How many people are able to show it like that? In fact, we have never even read about them.

Once You said Blavatskaya was the very good witch?

Guruji: That goes without saying — without doubt: she was the very special lady. Very psychic and even some powers which maybe appear magical to a normal person. She was the founder stone of “Theosophical Society”. And they were very deep into it; some of their books are readable — most of them. Their work on aura, astral travelling, out of the body experience — you must read those books. Many things are very valid there. I’ve read most of them.

What do You think, she must have some teacher?

Guruji: She claimed that — if we had to believe her — that some without-body lamas from Tibet was teaching her. It is very much possible; maybe their spirit saw that she’s a very good medium and they contacted her — it is very much possible. But that was before Dalai Lama escaped from Tibet, she is much senior. So — maybe, we believe it. Even if you look at her photograph and her eyes and the way she is standing — very majestic looking. And eyes: you can say — it’s a very powerful being inside.

Maybe some powerful spirit took birth in her body?

Guruji: Without any doubt! You cannot start such a big world movement just out of nothing. It maybe a collective plan; even if we just look at it: ok, Krishnamurti left the organization and the organization was ended; but his impact is still on the world — I mean philosophical impact is there. Maybe that was the climax of that organization.

You know her chart?

Guruji: I’ve never come across but it must be very special. That was the story in her life: she was travelling by sea, and very heavy wind was blowing; and somebody was trying to light a cigarette and failed so many times. She just did it easily; and in the heavy wind nothing happened and he was able to light his cigarette.